Бен Крамер — Книга 2: Драгоценность истинной мысли (Геше Йеше Вангчук о Дхармакирти), занятие 15

[Speaker 2]
For Curtis, Curtis is pretty good. You wanna say hi to everybody and then you go right away and I do work.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Hi. Yay.

[Speaker 2]
You shut the door for me.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Don't ask for too much, Dad. Oh, you got a homework for.

[Speaker 2]
I do. All right, here we go. Uh, when I'm King Kusumita the great patron of master Dharmakirti his work asked who was the greatest master.

How did master Dharmakirti answer him. I'm the greatest.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
He gave some categories, didn't he. He did.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, talk to me about it. And by the way, what's the Tibetan word for sponsor here. Patron sponsor.

Yeah, it is. Yeah, what did he say what were the categories, it's definitely true he said he's the greatest. What else did he say.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
He's a master Dignaga is the greatest master of wisdom.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah. Uh huh.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
And he said if you want the greatest master of. I'm gonna need some help here.

[Speaker 2]
Obvious to me I just happened to have been in my class and I was there and I'm trying to rely on memory which is never great.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
I wouldn't have known the others was one of them but not like morality.

[Speaker 2]
Anyone else want to use their, their notes. It's okay. Cool.

[Student]
Master of grammar and stuff but that's not what you're looking for.

[Speaker 2]
That probably is. Yeah, Chandragomin, and then shorter I'm going with shorter which was as far as we can get there's a poet apparently. Guess what I'm named.

Are you sure. And I put notes to you in the text so when you get it from me you'll get my attempts to guess that that he's the one. Sometimes, even maybe an alternate name for us for Gosha.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
I believe so. I believe so.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah. Okay.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
All right, so maybe so awesome for it.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, Master prosperity, you okay. But yeah, if you want the greatest of them all in any direction. You're looking at a baby.

Yeah, who if not me. Right. Cool.

How are master Dharmakirti's works received in his time, and how did he explain his feelings about that matter.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
They, they weren't understood, and people got jealous, and then they tie them to dogs, and they ran around India with them and he was like, that's great. This is the best advertisement ever.

[Speaker 2]
Totally. Great. And then we're gonna, we're going to work on that with the Diamond Cutter Press soon is going to send an army of dogs throughout the lands tied to their tails.

Yeah, great. Good, good, good, good, good. Oh, yeah.

Great. What does that mean.

[Student]
That means to the dog.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah.

[Speaker 2]
Fun. All right, cool. Um, do do do do what sentiment does Master Dharmakirti express about the fate of his work in the opening lines of the commentary on accurate perception.

[Student]
Talked about how people are really interested in things like Super Bowl games and movies and stuff and they don't aspire to reading classics. Yeah, but, and they have a lot of jealousy. And I don't think I really don't have the thought that this book is going to be a help to them.

But I just want to get my own mind to be familiar with it.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, that's nice. Yeah, right, exactly right. Yeah, wonderful.

Cool. I didn't. I didn't get a proper assignment boss so I took the next piece because it was easy.

It doesn't all up but, um, but it seemed relatively obvious ish.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Sounds good to me. So here's what you can you blow it up a little bit.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, I can hear. And then I've got faces over so I'm gonna. Here we go, something like that.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
All right, good. Yeah, good. A brief presentation of the meaning of this expansion.

Yeah, good. This che dak du means, now we're going to focus in on one of those books of logic. You see what I mean.

Oh, yeah, that's it. And then the word gap is often added on the name of the Pramana word.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, great. Okay, so here's the fourth section, right, in which we were going to narrow in on one of those hundred books we just narrow in on that's nice. All right, cool.

Okay. Yeah, all right, great. I'm going to stop sharing and I'm going to give you the plan.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Wait, that was it?

[Speaker 2]
That was it. I mean, I didn't get an assignment. I don't know.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
All right, all right, all right.

[Speaker 2]
You gave me nothing. I did something.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
That's like having to dig your own grave, right?

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, totally.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Here's my picture of Dharmakirti admitting his qualities. Okay.

[Speaker 2]
Hey.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
I'm the greatest. All right. Okay.

Who's going to check you? Nick likes to check Ben right off. I am.

Okay, go slow and you guys can work it out.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, so here's that first, I mean here's the first of the two sections, which will be and it doesn't look like he gives a second section he just launches into this being the first one which is going to have three parts.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah.

[Speaker 2]
And that's going to be, it looks like on the author on like an expansion on about the author like expense some expansive words about the these about three authors.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Sure, I mean so we're going to talk about their greatness.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, awesome threes three authors.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, yeah.

[Speaker 2]
All right.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Three authors or the greatness of the author is going to be described in three parts. It's three different samples. Okay.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, because it's the we're going to talk about the greatness of. Oh, I see. We're going to talk about the.

Oh, oh, oh. Oh, oh and then this the. And then the, the author the greatness of the author of this particular commentary that we're learning about the present work.

Yeah, yeah. Master Dharmakirti. And then we're going to talk about how great Devendrabuddhi is and maybe some other guys.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, I don't think they get much coverage but he just threw me. Okay.

[Speaker 2]
Okay. Guys like and then we're gonna talk about the greatest, the greatness of guys like. Yeah, exactly.

And maybe he'll mention one or two others. Yep, exactly. Cool.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
All right, since you Nick did that one so fast, I think you should do another one together.

[Speaker 2]
Okay.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
By the way. Wow, you'll find out. Here we go.

[Speaker 2]
Oh. Oh.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
So you guys work through it.

[Speaker 2]
Oh boy. Okay, boy.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Boy just left.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, I know I was hoping to come back in here, get me out of trouble but no. So, um, not so soon. She's what in the in the three lands or something, like, yeah, and then just master Dharmakirti, sorry, Dignaga.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yes, the same tree that Gibson just had.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, okay, great. All right, same, same three in the sky on the land on the ground.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
And by the way, it can mean the three realms, it has two different meanings. Yeah. Okay.

[Speaker 2]
1010 [?] like his name is known.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, he's famous on all three lands.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Talk about him the worms talk about him. People talk about.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, so the what, like to the far ends of, of the, of this land of Dambu, or no dumb Dambu.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Oh no. So again, you want to make 300 bucks. Yes, definitely.

Listen carefully. Okay, ready. 300 bucks, anybody can help you.

So gang it's, it's the end of the Wheel of Life, it's the words inscribed on the bottom. Oh, the link number 13. I mean people was wondering whether it can be a link number 13.

Crush, crush samsara like an elephant crushing a house made of reeds. Ah, 300 bucks for you. So gang.

You must have good karma because you didn't do any of it. Okay, okay, if you're sensitive, Dambu here means reeds, okay? And it's related to the word dam meaning swamp, okay?

So Dambudsel means the garden of reeds. It's an oblique reference to that verse, okay? Oh, wow.

Yeah, so this Chokyi Langpo, whose name means...

[Speaker 2]
Oh, directions.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Now listen to the verse from the Wheel of Life. Dambud khyim la mang chen shin Smash it like an elephant crushing reed, okay? It's a beautiful oblique reference, okay?

Okay, so he smashed the Lopamawas.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, the folks who were wrong.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, the flimsy reed structures.

[Speaker 2]
Uh-huh, all this bad, dumb stuff.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, yeah, Lhakme. He took their Dambud khyim and Lhakme jom.

[Speaker 2]
Uh-huh. He looked at Lhakme khyim and Lhakme jom. He destroyed their...

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, he destroyed their flimsy constructions to the last straw.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, yeah, until nothing was left over.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
And then he ten Lopamawas. He got students.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
He taught students who had... They were gelnden. Yeah, they were lucky to meet him.

And then Yeshe Wangchuk says, ga gashig Some of them? A few good students. Yeah, a couple.

It must be oblique reference number two. He was able to find a few good students, okay? And then he taught them the Rigpe Namdang Taiyipa.

This namdang doesn't mean synonyms. Versions? Good.

Different versions of rigspa.

[Speaker 2]
Logic, clear thinking.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, good. Taiyipa.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, like countless without measure.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, infinite number. And he jepa their laws. Oh, I have it here.

Yeah. It broke open in my... Okay.

I like that. That's nice. This is denye, which means to split open.

[Speaker 2]
Okay.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
With the prenasal. Okay. Yeah, good.

All right. I got to put this in here. I'm going to forget.

Okay, good. I don't know why word wants to... Okay.

All right. Now, who's going to check you? Chunzang?

Let's go.

[Speaker 2]
What was that?

[Student]
Can you say that again?

[Speaker 2]
I said bakta. I don't know. I'm just making noises.

But that's what it says.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Bakta is fine. Bakta is fine.

[Speaker 2]
Okay, go slow.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
And I think you can translate it with Chunzang if you go slow.

[Speaker 2]
Okay. Let's do it, Chunzang. The...

Let's find a verb. Chung.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Paro to Simba.

[Speaker 2]
Paro to Simba. I mean, he went to the far side of the ocean of schools, of philosophical systems of ours and others.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, good. Yep. This is the same as Paro to Simba.

Why didn't he say Paro to Simba?

[Speaker 2]
Oh, past tense?

[Geshe Michael Roach]
No. Past tense.

[Speaker 2]
Oh. Oh, he's getting other people there?

[Geshe Michael Roach]
No. It's honorific. It's polite.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, that's nice.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
He crossed the ocean of ours and other schools.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
And then, that's sort of a comma. He's a dhagmi chenpo.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, a mahatma. Quite the deity.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
His chungyul was in the hojok of Geogra.

[Speaker 2]
His chungyul... Birth country. Birth place.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah. The place of his birth is in the south of India. It's a chonk here.

[Speaker 2]
It's... Yeah, this far.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
A city.

[Speaker 2]
A city.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
It's a city called Sengebhagta, and I want you to try to find it, okay?

[Speaker 2]
Oh, got it. Sengebhagta. Try to find Sengebhagta.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah. It could be Senghabhagta or something. You see what I mean?

[Speaker 2]
Yeah. Something lion-y.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
And that's part of Kanchi.

[Speaker 2]
That's...

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Sorry, it's close to Kanchi.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, it's near there?

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, and Kanchi is still there. It's part of Tamil Nadu.

[Speaker 2]
It's near the land of Kanchipuram.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
And he tuned his coo in the rick of the Tamsins.

[Speaker 2]
He deigned to take his holy birth in the land of the Brahmins.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Riksu.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, as a Brahmin.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, in the castle. In the castle. Okay.

Christina Casica wants to check in now. Eat him up! Eat him up!

[Speaker 2]
Hello. My name is Chukpe Chukchane. I am 32 years old.

I am from Songchen, Cambodia. I am a teacher. I have been teaching for 21 years.

My name is Chukpe Chukchane. I am 32 years old. I am from Songchen, Cambodia.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Okay, here we go. Peltier means most people, it seems most likely, okay? It's likely that he was born in the juke of the Tudav Chukpa.

And Tudav means a century.

[Speaker 2]
Beginning of the 6th century?

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, and this is where you see the beginning of cultural pollution. Up until 1980 or something, you don't see Western references in Tibetan literature.

[Speaker 2]
Okay, so beginning of the century, he means our 6th century.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, and I got to tell you a story. I went to Varanasi looking for a Sanskrit scholar who was better than my Princeton scholar. I met the greatest one in Varanasi.

I took some classes from him, and we got to a phrase about the ruru deer, which is very dear to my heart. I asked him, what's a ruru deer? He said, well, I checked, and it's this special kind of small deer with brown skin.

I said, wow, thanks, I've been wondering about that since forever. He said, yeah, I just checked Monier Williams.

[Speaker 2]
Bummer.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
I was like, you know, that's where it's at. They're using books written by Westerners to figure out Sanskrit.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, that's not right.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Anyway, here it goes. Or you could say maybe it was at the go of the durab dumba.

[Speaker 2]
Okay, or it might have been, oh, at the end of the 7th century?

[Geshe Michael Roach]
In the opening of the 7th century.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, the opening. Didn't we have... oh, Djuk was the end then?

[Geshe Michael Roach]
It was the closing of the 6th century, yeah.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, Djuk Tsam is the...

[Geshe Michael Roach]
It seems like people pinpoint his birth as somewhere at the end of the 6th century or the beginning of the 7th century. Okay.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, so around about the time of the Tibetan King Songtsen Gampo.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, yeah. Now, he starts using verbs for reporting.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, yeah. There are, you know, you do hear people say this, or there are reports.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
That he lived during the time of the Tibetan King Songtsen Gampo, okay?

[Speaker 2]
Right.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
And you also... people also say...

[Speaker 2]
People also say that he was born at the time... was present at the time of...

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Djuk Tsam means contemporary.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, was it contemporary? Oh, interesting.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, yeah, okay.

[Speaker 2]
Of the... well, Master Vasubandhu and...

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, and the Tibetan King Lha Thothori, okay? Lha Thothori. And I went and got the...

here's the dates. Wiki says 480 to 540. I think that's correct.

Here's Lha Thothori, okay?

[Speaker 2]
We're going to... So he's, you know, we're going to let him report how he reports, right? Like, what do we...

we'll just footnote it and say...

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, yeah. I don't think there's much to say. But the dates seem to work out, yeah.

And here's a long biography of Tsongkapa if you're interested. But let's start here. Please read, and Seiji Arau wants to check you.

[Speaker 2]
Chokyi Langpo... Yeah, so Chokyi Langpo... Naga was...

what, like really was? Was a direct disciple.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, direct disciple of...

[Speaker 2]
Of Master Vasubandhu.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, and again he says, kun gyi she.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, kun gyi she. Oh, people say?

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, everybody is in agreement.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, everyone says it. Okay, everyone agrees. Cool.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
He was a direct disciple of Vasubandhu. When he was a chuladru, we had this before.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, when he was a little guy.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
When he was a little guy.

[Speaker 2]
He was born into the Brahmin caste.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
No, rik che.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, rik che. Oh, like the Vedas?

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, exactly, exactly.

[Speaker 2]
Vedic Brahmin.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
He jang the rik che's of the Brahmins.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, he practiced the Vedas of the Brahmins, in the non-Buddhist systems.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
And all the duptas of the mudekpas.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, yeah, right. All the philosophical beliefs of the non-Buddhists.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
And pul tu chen means pun samsokpa, same thing.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, he did it real nice too.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, he became... to perfection. Oh, okay.

Okay, who's next? Alex, the three of us, let's go. Hey, Alex, I was sitting in a store with my wife and Elvis Presley came on.

Take my life. Anyway, it was pretty good for Valentine's Day. Did you have a question, Nick?

Can jang mean study in that context? Yeah, it does exactly mean that. Yeah, he studied it.

Yeah, exactly, he studied it. He studied both the Vedas and the schools of the non-Buddhists.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, yeah, right.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
All right, here we go. Alex is checking you.

[Speaker 2]
Hello, everyone. I am a French teacher. I have been studying for a long time.

I have been studying for a long time. LANG PO RGYUN ZHES PA LAS RAB TU BYUNG ZHING TSEN CHOG KYI LANG POR SO Good, nice.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
I'm not sure if you know Yi Sun.

[Speaker 2]
I don't.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
It means he felt renunciation for.

[Speaker 2]
Okay. Oh, cool.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
He got sick of. He got sick of. He got sick and tired of korway dunyau.

[Speaker 2]
Sun? Related to like Sun Yipa?

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, exactly. Yep.

[Speaker 2]
Okay.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
And then he gave up his chakpa.

[Speaker 2]
Gave up his desire.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
For being a member of the Tamsin rig.

[Speaker 2]
Okay, for being a member of the Brahman caste.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Which is the highest and cushiest caste. Right. And he gave up all his lung chus.

[Speaker 2]
All his great stuff.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
And his lob mayi kor.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, and his lob mayi kor. Oh, did he have students in that tradition?

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, he already had a lot of students. And he gave them all up. Okay.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
And he got rab tu chung.

[Speaker 2]
And he, yeah, he was ordained.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Into the Buddhism, right? Under the Kempo of the Nema Bupe sect.

[Speaker 2]
Okay, under a Jain teacher.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
No, this is one of the 18 groups, I think.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, you're right. I'm sorry, the Nema Bupe. The Nema Bupe of Vatsiputriya's.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, yo. And his Kempo was named Nagadatta.

[Speaker 2]
Okay, Nagadatta. Maybe that's helpful, because we made up something maybe above. We weren't so sure.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
The Tibetan for which is Longbojin.

[Speaker 2]
Okay, yeah. Longbojin, the what? Giver of elephants?

What?

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Gift of the elephants, yeah. By the way, here's a case where Naga is...

[Speaker 2]
The white elephant. Sorry.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
This is a case where Naga is translated as Longbo, okay? Yeah.

[Speaker 2]
Okay, right.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Interesting. And Dignaga, by the way, the Naga in Dignaga means an elephant, right?

[Speaker 2]
Right, yeah.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
And it's the elephant of the eight directions.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, okay.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Okay, good.

[Speaker 2]
Their trunk looks like a snake maybe, right?

[Geshe Michael Roach]
I don't know. Okay, but anyway, here's an interesting thing, because his teacher's name is also elephant, and it's Naga. Yeah, right.

Okay. And that probably explains how he got his name actually. So he rubbed the trunk.

[Speaker 2]
We had a different explanation. We've had quite a few possible explanations now.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah.

[Speaker 2]
He also stated cave.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Sul means granted.

[Speaker 2]
Sorry, sul means? Granted. Oh, granted.

He was granted ordination by?

[Geshe Michael Roach]
No, he was granted the Zen Chogya Longbo.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, he was given the name Dignaga.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yay! Retaining something of his teacher's name, right? Cool, okay, fascinating.

All right, please read. Who else can I pick on? Hasso, let's go!

[Speaker 2]
Okay.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Good. He labpa the dena sum in the pigmen.

[Speaker 2]
He studied the three baskets in the lower way.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
And he became a kepa.

[Speaker 2]
And became a really smart guy, a master of that study.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Then he requested of his kembo, dom ngak, about how to do la from korwa.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, he asked for special personal advices from his teacher about how to get freedom from samsara, from the cycle of pain.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
And then his teacher gave him the following advice. I want you to tsul a dak.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, look for a you, a me, a self.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
And I don't want it to be the pumbo de nyi. And I don't want it to be pumbo le shen nyi.

[Speaker 2]
Okay, so it shouldn't be the same as your parts. And it shouldn't be something different from the parts. And you can't even really say what it is.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Good, perfect, yeah. That's the dampa that his teacher give to him.

[Speaker 2]
Okay, that's the dampa, the advice that his teacher gave him.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
And his teacher chukpa him to go about it.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, I don't know. I mean, I guess chukpa means instructed, but I don't know the word.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
He set him to meditating on it.

[Speaker 2]
He set him about meditating upon that.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
And he dembe dak tsel tsel tsel tsel tsel.

[Speaker 2]
And then he tried, just like that, and he looked and he looked and he looked. And manye. Manye, I guess he didn't find it.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
He never found manye. All right, good. Hey, how's everyone doing?

Let's get some exercise here.

[Speaker 2]
Okay. Okay, good.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
GAR KUNG, I don't think you know. I don't know it very well, but it means windows, okay? The old, like shutters, okay?

So he opened all the shutters during the day, okay? And in the tsenmo, he started marmes.

[Speaker 2]
And then he lit butter lamps at night.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, bar means he lit, okay? Bar, he lit to make things light, okay? And not only that, he ended up cher bupa.

[Speaker 2]
Naked.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
He took off all his clothes also. And he looked everywhere in the chi and in the nang.

[Speaker 2]
Looked inside and out.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, yang yang te.

[Speaker 2]
Over and over.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
He looked everywhere. Then mi shen tong him.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, and then no one else saw him.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
No one else saw him.

[Speaker 2]
They did see him. Oh, other guys.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
And they went and sherpa de to his khenpo langpa je.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, they told his teacher.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, he's acting kooky. Okay. And then the khenpo said to chok lang, de dak je pa chi yin.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, why are you acting like that?

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, what are you trying to do? Okay. All right, Xiaoping wants to check you.

I can see she has a headache from these two classes already.

[Speaker 2]
Okay. Chok lang gi dak mi lo tsul shik lo dru men be. Khenpo tsen be dak de ni.

Ma tong de de chir jip je ki jip sam yam de chi nang kun tu. Da wa yin shi be.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Okay, and chok lang gi replied.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, Dignaga said...

[Geshe Michael Roach]
I must be lo du.

[Speaker 2]
I must be what, du, I must be a dummy?

[Geshe Michael Roach]
I must be dull-minded.

[Speaker 2]
Sorry, yeah, I must be dull in absence.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
I must be dull-minded, and my lo du must be men be.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, my intelligence must be little.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Because the de ni which the khenpo ten to dak.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, that suchness, that self that the teacher, that was taught by the master.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, and this changes the story a little bit from the other version we have, because when I went looking for the dak as described by you, as described by you, ma tong.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, ma tong, I didn't find that one, de ni, that self.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
So I started thinking, maybe I'm jip je ki jip.

[Speaker 2]
Maybe I'm just, yeah, full of obstruction, impurity.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, I must be, I thought I must be shrouded by something, so I took off everything, including the lights, and I checked chi dang nang kun la.

[Speaker 2]
And I looked everywhere, inside and out.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, and shu past tense.

[Speaker 2]
Shu past tense.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
That's honorific. He asked? No, he spoke to his teacher.

Literally, he offered it to his teacher. But it's the polite, polite, polite word for answer your teacher. So up to here, they are still getting along.

He honorably responded to his teacher. Who gets to do this part?

[Speaker 2]
Great, great. Pardon? Sorry.

Oh, yung. Pardon? KYANG RANG GI KHYEN POR KHO BA'I MA YIN NO NYAMS NAS PHAGS TSAL NAS CHUN CHUN You and Sugeng can translate this.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
By the way, ma rang means displeased.

[Speaker 2]
Okay, the lama or the teacher being displeased.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah. What's the opposite? It's a yi rang.

[Speaker 2]
Aha, yi rang.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
To celebrate, right? Yeah.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah. KHO BA'I...

[Geshe Michael Roach]
I had to look up sur sawa. Sur sawa means to criticize in an indirect way.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, you've criticized our system.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, I think you're actually trying to criticize our system. So it's implied. Sur sawa means...

I think what you're really saying is you don't agree with our system.

[Speaker 2]
KHYOD DIR MA GDUG KHYOD DIR MA GDUG Don't do that?

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Don't stay here anymore.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, don't stay here.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
DIR means to kick somebody out. Okay. So he kicked him out.

Now the next line you know, and I'm not going to say anything. You guys work it out.

[Speaker 2]
Oh. KHYOD DIR MA GDUG KHYOD DIR MA GDUG Then having...

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Oh, by the way, sung yun is the future tense of sun jin.

[Speaker 2]
Future tense of sun jin. Oh. Oh, right.

Oh, right. Yeah. He saw like...

Like he debated with him or he...

[Geshe Michael Roach]
He knew he had the nupa.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, he knew he had the nupa, the ability to tear him down, to... Crush him. Yeah, to rip him a new one with logic.

Yeah. But... Yeah, he saw...

It would be inappropriate.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah. It wasn't appropriate to go with this Khenpo.

[Speaker 2]
To debate with his teacher.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, and with that in mind, yam ne. He took a nice chak so.

[Speaker 2]
He bowed sweetly and hit the road.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yep, and he left. Okay. This chair means to the outside.

Okay. He went... He departed.

Okay. Okay, some... Gibson, check this guy.

[Speaker 2]
Okay. GAR THEG PA CHEN PO'I DO DE NGA RGYA THUG LA ZHUNG NAS KA THUN ZAD Okay, translate.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Oh, he had the SAB PA THOD TSUL BA THEG PA CHEN PO.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, he thought to look into the baskets of the greater way.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, to seek the three baskets of the greater way. So he DZUN to the DRUNG of YIG NI.

[Speaker 2]
What's the DRUNG of Master Vasubandhu?

[Geshe Michael Roach]
DRUNG means into the presence of.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, okay. So he came... So he, yeah, went left.

Went to the presence of, yeah, Master Vasubandhu.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, and he SEMS all the THEG PA CHEN PO'I DO DE NGA RGYA THUG LA ZHUNG NAS in the presence of this master.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, SEMS like what? What? Familiarized?

[Geshe Michael Roach]
THUB PA, THUB PA, THUB PA.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, THUB PA.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Honorifics.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, THUB PA. I'm sorry. Studied, learned, heard.

Yeah, he learned all the DENAS. All the baskets. Of the THEG PA CHEN PO'I DO DE NGA RGYA THUG LA ZHUNG NAS Yeah, both the Hinayana and Mahayana in that Lama's presence.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
And having heard it, he DRUNGed it.

[Speaker 2]
And then, oh, having heard it, he what, perfected it?

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, he became a master of it. Yeah, he mastered it. In the end, he was able to SVA RGYA RGYA.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, recite?

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, he was able to recite DO DE NGA RGYA.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, the 500... Sutras. Sutras of the Greater Way.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
THEG PA CHEN PO'I DO DE NGA RGYA THUG LA ZHUNG NAS Because he had ZINNED them in his THUG.

[Speaker 2]
Wow, well done. He had memorized them. He held them in his heart.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yay, nice job. Okay, who's going to help you now? This is pretty, Timothy Lohrhout, let's go.

[Speaker 2]
Thank you very much.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
And then he met up with a Dorje Lopon.

[Speaker 2]
A diamond.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, and he got the WANG for Jambayin.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, he was empowered into the practice of Manjushri.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
And he got the oral transmission of the NGAG DE.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, of the NGAG DE, the secret words. Where, oh, where are you?

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Where was I? DER PA means to repeat the secret words, okay?

[Speaker 2]
Oh, NGAG DE. Okay, so DER PA, you're unpacking into NGAG DE.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, he got the oral lineage for the mantra of Manjushri.

[Speaker 2]
Okay.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
And then he duk duk duk duk.

[Speaker 2]
Wow, he achieved that.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Well, he practiced, practiced, practiced. And then he seeked the shell of Jamyang.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, he saw the face of Manjushri.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
He met Manjushri face to face. Shell seek is a very, very, very sweet expression, which means to meet an angel face to face. Okay, I like it.

Then he got from that Jetsun, Jamyang, many dumpasamos.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, lots of profound teachings.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, personal advices, right?

[Speaker 2]
Of course, yeah, right.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
And then he went to the NGAG cell of Odivisha, NGAG CHUG TU, DUG PA'I WANG CHUG, DOR JI DUG BU PA. This is, what is it? Udiana, I think.

Udiana. But he went to this part of India, which is known for its lonely forests, okay?

[Speaker 2]
Oh, yeah, he went into the forests of Odisha.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah.

[Speaker 2]
Okay, way far off, it's related.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
And there's a certain chok within Odivisha named Botasala, okay?

[Speaker 2]
There's a place, a chok, a direction?

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, there's one area in southern Odivisha called Botasala. See if you can find it.

[Speaker 2]
Okay.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
And he stayed in a dark pukh.

[Speaker 2]
I mean, a cave?

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, a mountain cave. Okay.

[Speaker 2]
And he meditated single-pointedly there.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yay. All right. Rebecca, are you ready?

Your cat can help you if you want.

[Speaker 2]
Your cat can help you. Oh, I thought you meant cat, right. Cat can also help you, but your cat.

Better yet. Okay. Good.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Okay, this is a long story. That means several. Logasamme.

[Speaker 2]
Okay. Logasamme. I don't know.

Oh, he came across several?

[Geshe Michael Roach]
After several years.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, after several years. Yeah.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Good. There was a certain Muthegchamse.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, there was a non-Buddhist Brahmin.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Hanging around Nalanda, okay?

[Speaker 2]
Hanging around Nalanda, okay.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
He was a high yogi. He could see his La Munsum.

[Speaker 2]
Okay, he could see his La Munsum. He could directly see...

[Geshe Michael Roach]
His own personal deity, yeah.

[Speaker 2]
Wow, nice.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Okay. And he was also very jangwa in toke.

[Speaker 2]
In toke. Oh, letters?

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Formal logic.

[Speaker 2]
Okay. Very well trained in formal logic.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, and he was very gawa for shens to tuba.

[Speaker 2]
He was hard up for other people to...

[Geshe Michael Roach]
It was difficult for other people to tuba him.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, to what?

[Geshe Michael Roach]
To beat him in debate, yeah.

[Speaker 2]
Okay. And his name, is that his name there? Pudurajaya.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, his name is Pudurajaya.

[Speaker 2]
Okay, all right, we'll go on.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
But who knows if it's spelled right. Good luck.

[Speaker 2]
Okay.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
And he used to tuba with a lot of other Muthegs.

[Speaker 2]
He'd debate with a bunch of other non-Buddhists.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah. And the Sangye Panditas were unable to tuba with him.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, yeah, the Buddhist scholar masters weren't able to debate with him.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah. And then, so Chokyi Langpo came from Odivisha.

[Speaker 2]
Okay, yeah, when he came from there.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
And he chendang that Brahman to this place, to tuba.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, yeah, he invited him to this place, is now Nalanda, or to...

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, probably Nalanda, yeah.

[Speaker 2]
Or is it Odivisha?

[Geshe Michael Roach]
I think it's Nalanda, yeah.

[Speaker 2]
Okay.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Okay, please read with Tim. Was Tim checking you before? Utpala, Venerable Utpala.

Okay. Okay, Arlopan Tsepa with this soul of the Muthegs lent him.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, he mastered with this principal dude of the non-Buddhists three times. They debated three times.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
And Arlopan pumped... I'm sorry, the other guy got pumped.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, yeah, okay, he got beat.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah.

[Speaker 2]
He did done beat him.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
And then Dignaga debated other Muthegs and pumped them with his rikspa.

[Speaker 2]
Okay, then he did done pump-hardened other...

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Oh, sorry, we're over time. Just let me know. Okay, one more.

Let's do this half sentence. He forced them to Nangma.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, he turned them into Buddhists.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, he turned them into Buddhists, okay. And then there should be a pause there, because then he stayed in Nalanda and shayed the chö to the monks.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, yeah, and then he taught the Dharma of the three baskets. What, to these new turkeys maybe?

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Yeah, to the Buddhist monks. Possibly to the new ones, yeah.

[Speaker 2]
These new venerable Buddhist honorable monks.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Okay, cool. I think also to the existing monks there, yeah.

[Speaker 2]
Okay.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Okay. All right. I'll give you some advice, Ben.

Enjoy this nice little bar, because it's going to kick your mental butt.

[Speaker 2]
Sure, that won't be hard.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
When you get to the real text, you won't understand anything.

[Speaker 2]
Oh, good.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
So, just enjoy, okay? And if you could, do the next two sections, okay?

[Speaker 2]
Okay, yeah, starting with nama-rikpa and...

[Geshe Michael Roach]
And apta-salte, apta-salte, because you already knew that. That was written on the side of a certain cave.

[Speaker 2]
I should be able to handle that. All right, I'll go steal it.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
Okay, I'll see you guys in five minutes.

[Speaker 2]
Yeah, we got six.

[Geshe Michael Roach]
I should see you too. Yeah. Enjoy it while you can.

Thank you, thank you guys.

[Student]
Thank you, Geshe La.